Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Chair throwing

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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete, as no one besides Colonel Warden found anything which would lend notability to chair throwing as a phenomenon, and even the sources he provided were weak. There is no consensus to merge this content elsewhere. A redirect to chair may be appropriate. lifebaka++ 13:35, 13 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Chair throwing[edit]

Chair throwing (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View log)

Delete Non encyclopedic nonsense created for no reason other than to gather together a few anecdotes about people throwing chairs. Mayalld (talk) 15:35, 1 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • Weak keep. If I throw a chair, that's NN. If Steve Balmer throws chairs, that's news. Is there a cultural tradition of throwing chairs in anger trying to escape from this article? It's the angriest thing you can do in a room short of attacking a person (which is the usual borderline for police involvement and legal redress). On that basis, is there something to document here? Any cowboy film has its bar-room brawl scene where things are truly seen to "kick off" at the point when the first chair is lifted.

Listing anecdotes is cruft. Furniture design is an irrelevance. Sport-hurling is a footnote. Andy Dingley (talk) 15:56, 1 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • Delete per nom. Merge and redirect --John (talk) 03:47, 2 August 2008 (UTC) (altered --John (talk) 00:25, 3 August 2008 (UTC))[reply]
  • Merge to chair. I think whatever big verifiable facts there are here will fit just nicely as a section in that article. Fdp (talk) 08:51, 2 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete neither an Olympic sport, nor encyclopaedic; more a fit of pique. Kbthompson (talk) 11:30, 2 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Merge and redirect to Chair. There is nothing else here to warrant its own article, and does not seem to offer much potential for improvement, so I think the merge is appropriate. Off! (talk) 13:51, 2 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I'd rather see it deleted than merged with Chair. How about hiving off that section Chair#English phrases relating to chairs and sticking them both off somewhere separate. Andy Dingley (talk) 20:38, 3 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete Seems trivial why not have pages on throwing other objects, or kicking them, or hitting them or dropping them......Bevo74 (talk) 12:46, 4 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete Pretty damn hilarious: "Chair throwing is the act of throwing a chair at someone." I can just repeat that mantra in my head until it seems like an actual topic for study, but it'll take a while. Yes, there are documented cases of chairs being thrown at others; no, these sparse incidents do not have a cultural significance or history like pieing. Unless there's a study showing a statistical prevalence of chairs being thrown over other household objects, like lamps, ottomans, or feather dusters, I doubt there's any reason to document the phenomenon (no, really, just delete it already). ˉˉanetode╦╩ 23:25, 5 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep or Merge with Chair. I've considered improving the article, but I have limited time to spend on Wikipedia at the moment. Merging is not always appropriate as it can clutter the target article. Redirecting may be inappropriate as it loses content. I agree with Andy Dingley's reasoning for keeping it as a separate article. The question is whether this phenomenon is notable enough to deserve an article on Wikipedia, I do believe a merge could be beneficial. Officeworld (talk) 11:13, 6 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • When searching, one should look at the hits, not the misses. The specific hit I saw that indicated that we had the bones of a topic here was A Handbook of Behavior Modification for the Classroom which said, "Chair Throwing Quite often chair throwing is attention-seeking behavior and should be ignored. When this behavior is directed at an object such as a wall or ...". This seems to be a reliable source which discusses the topic specifically to the extent that it has a section heading with this title. Q.E.D. Colonel Warden (talk) 06:03, 7 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • This source merely demonstrates that it is a frequent weapon of opportunity, in one highly specialised context (where the variety of large throwable objects is likely to be limited). It hardly substantiates this as a general topic of widespread notability -- particularly as the article makes no mention of chair-throwing in schools. HrafnTalkStalk 06:50, 7 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete and redirect to Chair - well the article is sourced, this topic is not notable on its own. --T-rex 16:04, 6 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Merge to Chair. The fact that chairs can be (and have been) thrown is worth a mention. However no one has yet written the history of chair throwing. WP can not be the first since that would be original research. BTW the mention of chair throwing as a fundraiser is uncited and seems a little dubious to me. Northwestgnome (talk) 16:36, 6 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Smerge to Chair or Bobby Knight. Chair throwing as an out-of control expression of anger and intimidation for adults who do not have a pacifier to spit out has 2100 news stories covering individual incidents [1], but I found no sources talking about "chair throwing" as a distinct cultural phenomenon. Out of these, 1170 mention Knight. Another good merge target would be Tantrum. (If they outlaw chairs, only outlaws will have chairs, at least until they throw them). Edison (talk) 17:00, 6 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete: any physical object can be thrown. This article does not demonstrate that the throwing of chairs is a coherent or notable topic. HrafnTalkStalk 17:54, 6 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Addendum: in response to the suggestions that it should be turned into a 'list of chair throwing incidents', the fact that a few specific incidents of this activity have received coverage is not indication that the activity in general is notable or even a cohesive topic. As I said "any physical object can be thrown", and such a list would invite similar lists on the throwing of bottles, drink-cans, rocks, eggs, pies, etc, etc -- none of which would appear to be particularly encyclopaedic, but all of which can find a comparable number of publicised incidents to chair-throwing. WP:STAND#Appropriate topics for lists & WP:NOT#Content ("Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information") would appear to apply. HrafnTalkStalk 05:54, 7 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • (2nd) Addendum: I was tempted to change my opinion to suggest renaming the article 'List of celebrity tantrums' (of which chair-throwing tantrums is merely a trivial subcategory) -- but decided that this raised too many WP:BLP problems -- it's quite simply tabloid journalism. The psychological aspects of this issue would far better be addressed in an article on the 'Psychology of attention-seeking behaviour'. In both cases, the fact that the tantrum/attention-seeking involves chairs (versus any other throwable object) is entirely incidental. Shall we also have a 'List of Nobel Prize winners who wore blue to the awards ceremony '? HrafnTalkStalk 05:53, 10 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Comment The criteria/new names suggested here are Straw men and the rest is then simply WP:IDONTLIKEIT. The argument's fatal flaw is that wikipedia has a much broader based of inclusion than a print encyclopedia. And although wikipedia aims to cover what other encyclopedias cover, it is by no means trying to imitate them. For example, only on wikipedia can one find an article on pastafarians. An article on Chair throwing, a list of chair throwing incidents, or a list of tantrums involving thrown objects...anyone would be a signature wikipedia article, just as this article is clearly shaping up to be. --Firefly322 (talk) 14:48, 11 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Strong delete It's nothing but WP:SYNTH to take three "notable" incidents in which a chair was thrown to create an article about throwing chairs. Aside from the obvious trolling involved here, there's nothing presented to support an assertion that "chair-toss events" are noteworthy & encyclopedic. I'll consider a change in my opinion if anyone provides multiple independent reliable sources that discuss these alleged fund raiser events. — Scientizzle 20:08, 6 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Notice I removed a myrad of WP:SPA, blocked and IP votes from the same IP range from this discussion in This revision. While these votes are almost certainly no more then troll or sockpuppet votes, i think that there must still be some notification they were removed. Excirial (Talk,Contribs) 23:11, 6 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
"List of XXX incidents" would be thwe worst sort of listcruft. Is there something specific to the act of throwing chairs that is notable? Does it represent some particular social boundary that is either approached or transgressed? If we can identify that, then an artcle (not this one!) might be justified. If it's just a list of how many times Balmer lost his rag, that's cruft. Of course a list of examples might still form part of such an article.
On the whole, given the likelihood of any worthwhile article emerging from this, I'm inclining to delete. Not because it needs to be deleted, but because Wikipedia can't produce a useful article in the narrow slot of justifiable notability.Andy Dingley (talk) 18:56, 7 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep adjust the name to list of per Jclemens and expand along the lines of the sources demonstrated to exist per Colonel Warden. --Firefly322 (talk) 03:55, 7 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Strong delete as per Hrafn. Colonel Warden's citation is countered by bottle throwing. As Hrafn said, all sorts of objects are thrown around, notability for chair throwing is not established by citing a few incidents. They belong in the articles of the chair throwers as perhaps illustrations of their poor temperament. There is no meaningful pattern to be covered by an article or list. I would however encourage the supporters of this article to create a list of attention-seeking behaviors (violent, temperamental, etc.) and then a list of famous incidents of those. –MT 18:29, 7 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment –M's strong delete suggestion doesn't really address the guidlines found in WP:STAND#Appropriate topics for lists. The guidelines say that a list should not be too broad. The guidelines say that a list should not be too narrow. So in order for him or her to cite and properly follow Hrafn's train of thought, such a support debater would need to address how the list is too broad or too narrow. M's comment simply misses the mark, failing to address policy and integrate it with the train of thought set by Hfran's citation of [WP:STAND#Appropriate topics for lists]]. Unless M can address the fundamental list guideline of too narrow or too broad. His or her comment is merely an WP:IDONTLIKEIT WP:AFD comment. --Firefly322 (talk) 00:52, 8 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment Non-notability implies narrowness. While I support a list of famous tantrums, a list of thrown chairs is random. It is up to supporters to "explain why this list contributes [in any way] to the state of human knowledge." –MT 18:41, 8 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment So u think the list as specified is too narrow (though too broad is problematic...I agree that it might not be a notability issue in that case). So would you support a keep on the condition of move to "List of famous tanturms" ? --Firefly322 (talk) 05:11, 10 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Yes, though to avoid AfD I would urge someone to try to establish the notability of that list. –MT 20:53, 10 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep Chair throwing is a distinct behaviour often referenced by psychologists. Carol Kalish Fanclub (talk) 01:36, 10 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • Do you have anything to back that up? Psychologists talk about any number of behaviors, it remains to be seen whether "chair throwing" has any prevalence in such discussions. There certainly hasn't been any real research on the topic. ˉˉanetode╦╩ 04:02, 10 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • Although someone cool enough to come up with a user name of Carol Kalish Fanclub gets a certain amount street cred, without evidence or without picking up some thread of the argument by one of the other participants here, seems more like a comment than a !vote.—Preceding unsigned comment added by Firefly322 (talk • contribs)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
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